Curse

Perrsun · Jul 29, 2006, 05:52 AM // 05:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghull Ka

kiting

I had a kite as a child. I do not know where it is this day.

TadaceAce · Jul 29, 2006, 06:55 AM // 06:55

is a comment really neccessary? this build really... is no good... it has a lot more counters that your premade boon prot. Your only real self heals are mysticism, healing breeze, and RoF..... any good damage build will eat you before you know what happened.

threedices · Jul 29, 2006, 07:35 AM // 07:35

tried in pvp.....my idea? this is not a pvp super build at all.
a smart pvp group (which you can definitely encounter within few rounds) would interrupt you or just spike on you. then it's over.
otherwise....you can't be killed...a 18 min long RA first fight definitely supports the sustainability of this build.
infuse can defend a spike against a fellow teammate...but NOT while you are casting the energy loop spells
if one or two spells got disabled (constant casting looks kinda obvious...), same thing..
Nature's Renewal eats you badly (but eats other enchant heal too...)
....probably works better since mobs won't pick on you, or am I just too dumb? whatever...

I guess you can always save the work and be a good monk

majoho · Jul 29, 2006, 08:34 AM // 08:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ganik Thress

Incorrectly correctly capitalizing the first letter of each word is bad mojo!

Yeah actually it's amazing how much it affects readability when people post that way, pretty annoying.

(actually it's against the forum guidelines as well I think so don't do it).

Tookis Elite · Jul 29, 2006, 10:08 AM // 10:08

know how many of these my dervish has eaten?

LeDen · Jul 29, 2006, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Yesterday I made a build similar to this:
Mysticism 16
Heal Prayers 8
Prot Prayers 10

-Reversal
-Shield Guardian
-Guardian
-Shielding Hands
-Healing Breeze
-Shield of Regenerations
-Contemplation of Purtiy
-Prot Spirit

This one has better self-heal (RoF, SG, SoR, Breeze), but no heal for your team.
The only real purpose of this one is to annoy people trying to kill you and laugh at their comments: "How can you do that?".

xb0vv · Jul 29, 2006, 10:50 AM // 10:50

lmao try that with boon prot

lightblade · Jul 29, 2006, 11:41 AM // 11:41

I just tested this build, the truth is...it is not that good...

Mystism's effect only applies to enchantments that are casted on yourself, so when you try to protect others, there won't be energy return back

Zuranthium · Jul 29, 2006, 01:37 PM // 13:37

Funny, everyone isn't getting it. Which is good for me...less people will play it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TadaceAce

is a comment really neccessary? this build really... is no good... it has a lot more counters that your premade boon prot. Your only real self heals are mysticism, healing breeze, and RoF..... any good damage build will eat you before you know what happened.

Wrong. I only take 10% damage per attack, I have +7 health Regen, I'm gaining 48 health through mysticism every other second, plus evading from guardian and being healing by reversal. Not to mention I can Life Sheath myself and prevent damage too. I've let 3 melee opponents stand there and beat on me and they can't get through it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lightblade

I just tested this build, the truth is...it is not that good...

Mystism's effect only applies to enchantments that are casted on yourself, so when you try to protect others, there won't be energy return back

While healing others you're constantly keep Reversal + Guardian + Breeze on yourself. As I said in the original post, it's NOT any easy build to play; you are casting at everying single moment. With those 3 spells on you, you're gaining additional mana over time and healing yourself of all the damage being incurred by Infuse Health. Infuse + Life Sheath + Healing Breeze by themselves is over 500 points of damage removal every 10 seconds for another player -- and this build can infinitely do that every 10 seconds without dropping in health or mana. If a melee is attacking you it actually HELPS your mana supply. Without someone on you, reversal grabs +3 mana every 8 seconds. However, when you're being attacked reversal can constantly be recast and you're getting +3 mana every 2 seconds while still not sustaining any damage yourself. I've Infused multiple times over a short period of time with 2 melee people beating on me. Show me a Monk who can fend off damage from 2 attackers whilst still keeping an ally alive who is being attacked by 2 people as well.

NinjaKai · Jul 29, 2006, 01:42 PM // 13:42

Shame that a good class is going the way of the touch ranger.

BahamutKaiser · Jul 29, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

I actually think this gives alot of power to some of the Assassin shutdowns, diversion is nice and all, but if the dervish has 3+ quick enchantment skills you arn't going to knock them all out.

How about Shadow Shroud and Shroud of Silence. Your not enchanting a damn thing now.

I think it is rather intuitive that a melee class can now spam some quick enchantments for added healing and energy, compared to Monk who gets extra healing to all his spells on himself and allies, the Dervish will be front line.

What I don't like is that this underscores the 2 classes Dervish is seriously compeating with, Assassin and Elementist. It is pretty obvious that Dervish is doing more DoT in a medium area of attack for free, then you add on a few whirling skills and nearby damage spells and you got some serious outmatching, and compared to Assassin who can be shutdown by just one evasive move, not being able to continue his assault, the dervish will be swinging at groups continously. This class gets some strong use of enchantments with his health and energy return, and a scythe along with some adrenaline skills can be used for some quick build-up.

Truth is though, I don't think it needs to be nerfed, it is exactly what people would enjoy in a class, simple and effective, what we need is improvements to Elementist skills and Assassins effeciency, I have been saying it since GWP came out, and since Assassin came out in GWF, these classes just arn't effective enough, not with Ele DoT skills and not with Assassins PoS teleports.

You put a bunch of Dervishes out there with an easily renewing gardian enchantment and what you have is an Assassin harvestor, Assassins will not be able to complete their combos and they have weak enough armor for Dervish to reap right up.

I have noticed that though the scythe can hit all adjacent foes, I think it does less damage to all other than the target. I didn't parse this, so try it for yourself, but it seems to me that it isn't going to wipe out an entire group alone (but it is a mockery of Firestorm and other DoTs). I would like these classes to stay as good as they are, and have others improved rather than nerfed.

As I see it, in order for Dervish to deal effective damage with their scythe, they will need to surround themselves with enemies, now tell me that is a favorable situation for a class with 70 armor and a little elemental defense...... they are basically dependant on their effective enchantment use to move in on a group of enemies.

Quinn Falcon · Jul 29, 2006, 02:04 PM // 14:04

The irony of which being that there's probably a couple of real ranger builds could put this build to rest pretty quickly.

Horseman Of War · Jul 29, 2006, 02:09 PM // 14:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuranthium

Dervish/Monk

16 Mysticism
9 Healing Prayers
9 Protection

Infuse Health
Life Sheath
Reversal of Fortune
Guardian
Protective Spirit
Healing Breeze
Contemplation of Purity
Rez Signet

1. its not like youre the only one using D/Mo like that right now... first thing I did after making my first dervish was immediately change to DMo and using many of those skills (except breeze)

2. backfire. gg. lol. no nerf required. Spiteful?

3. people are quickly becoming wise to the dervish ways... and the countering of COMMON builds like this one (sorry, its true buddy)

linh · Jul 29, 2006, 04:56 PM // 16:56

I guess OP's build is for RA ? And you can guess a "nerf" because it is "too good" ?

I also can play Boon Prot in RA and win easily. Nerf plz

CKaz · Jul 29, 2006, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghull Ka

The primary attributes for both the paragon and dervish are pretty uninspired. "How are we going to make this class's energy management unique and quirky? We've got energy when people die... energy when you score a critical hit... OOH, how about energy when an enchantment wears off!? Sweet!"

Bah, whatever.

Yeah it is interesting, outside the Ritualist every primary since core involves routes of energy coming back. Maybe it points out the general energy return tools aren't that great, do they need to do that to generate interest?

Meanwhile classes that could really use it need to spend elites to try to compete at all... eh... flash in the pan primaries without support outside their chapter ftw? /shrug

I'm sure warriors and eles would love some re-tooling there - strength bites and now non-phy damage is a fair bit tougher for the warrior, and energy storage looks less and less interesting while the eles are more [limited] utility than anything else in pvp. Heck why go ele PBAoE, get a lot more in the Dervish. And Paragons look to have a lot more utility.

And as noted the Dervish can even be a very effective healer without divine, heck even without leveraging the monk class. I think its great the monk gets challenged - I think its odd two classes are coming out that really dip into that world and cross over a bunch of other realms as well.

But finally, yeah, I think its goofy. Both classes in their own way. Could the Dervish have anything more to do with enchantments

with benefit on the way in and out? And the forms with no counters... shrug... I should head to pvp discussion - along with the Paragon and instant chanting and echos and shouts, seems like your going to HAVE to deal with them, and meanwhile I'm not sure if there are a lot of tools to counter.

Or is that going to be the majority of the new core class skills, so they have a chance to deal with all this? And maybe, if they get anything, that's what will come the Assassin and Ritualist way? I dunno I'm kind of wondering if the Assassin is DoA with Nightfall - without more support, I'd certainly have to lean that way PvE, the Dervish looks to be MUCH better in that world. The Ritualist still has a niche as an 'engineer' type I think, but bit too early to see if that'll be enough to best Paragon's 'on the move' style, and the Derv seems to have atleast a skill that brings some harsh spirit hurt.

Eh, but yeah I didn't find the primaries that inspiring, almost feels like a form of Ether Renewal meets Blessed Signet got shoe-horned onto the Dervish (and those classes can only dream of that kind of energy to boot). Paragons echos and their energy gain too... yeah... nice for them to worry about those classes to hold up in long fights. Be nice to see some more help to the core - not nerfing elite enchantments to 7 seconds.

Horseman Of War · Jul 29, 2006, 05:49 PM // 17:49

after playing a dervish for about 10 hours straight the other night... I decided to dust off my original character... my mesmer/necro...

Didnt even change my build - it was already there and i didnt know it.

Echo + Desecrate Enchantments = over 200 shadow dmg to a averagly-enchanted Derv. And once people start lowering their HP with runes... itll all be gravy baby. (this is just a non-SS build i run)

Zuranthium · Jul 29, 2006, 07:27 PM // 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horseman Of War

1. its not like youre the only one using D/Mo like that right now... first thing I did after making my first dervish was immediately change to DMo and using many of those skills (except breeze)

Obviously other people have tried D/Mo but I have yet to see a HEALER D/Mo. Ever since the new classes have been released for testing I've been playing non-stop across all the different battlefields - RA/TA/12v12/GvG/HA....and NOBODY has used this idea. I was in a 5 D/Mo HA group, but that build was based around AoE spike. Nope, this is my build.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horseman Of War

2. backfire. gg. lol. no nerf required. Spiteful?

Contemplation of Purity, buddy. Faster recharge then Spiteful and especially Backfire.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horseman Of War

Echo + Desecrate Enchantments = over 200 shadow dmg to a averagly-enchanted Derv. And once people start lowering their HP with runes... itll all be gravy baby. (this is just a non-SS build i run)

I use a Sup Mysticism rune (you HAVE to) and still have 515 HP (560 when enchanted).

kvndoom · Jul 29, 2006, 08:36 PM // 20:36

You guys don't get it...

This was minutes after they whooped PnH in less than 12 minutes.

This is ridiculous. They can camp the rez shrine and kill the whole squad in less than 15 seconds, if that. Never, ever seen anything like this.

Demalii · Jul 29, 2006, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Well don't think you're the only person who can think up a build.. If it wasn't obvious to run a build like this, iono what is.. I've seen tons of people running builds like this, as well as myself which I did yesterday morning around 10am

Zonzai · Jul 29, 2006, 09:03 PM // 21:03

This is like the third person I've seen claiming that they invented this build. Damn good build by the way.